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Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe remaster

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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Soupy94 » Wed Mar 08, 2006 7:08 pm

Willy: Thanks for the update, man!

Ciao

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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Bob Nelson » Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:14 pm

This I can't wait for. Strange Universe is my favorite album . Child Of The Novelty was the first thing I ever heard by Mahogany Rush, and I was hooked forever. That was in 1974 when it was first released in the USA. I heard Maxoom last of these three, and always loved it also. I am very partial to "classic" Mahogany Rush.
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Dragonfly2 » Thu Mar 09, 2006 5:24 am

Thanks Willy. :P
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Re: re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe

Post by Wild Willy » Thu Mar 09, 2006 7:29 am

EmperorIV wrote:I am hoping that they really somehow maintain the original artwork! Those records jumped out at ya in the record stores and hopefully they'll do the same in the smaller jewel box!!

I did have a question! On my BigBeat records remasters of the first 3, there was some "noise" at the beginning of the song "Look Outside" from Child...were the tapes used for those remasters the same ones Frank just used?
Frank used tapes that no one else has access to. BigBeat probably went straight from vinyl.

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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Erik » Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:16 pm

Hi Willy,

Sorry to bother you with one more question but i´m confused.
You wrote.

Thank you Frank for allowing me this honor. Onto IV, What's Next, World Anthem, Live, Tales of the Unexpected, Power of Rock and Roll, Juggernaut etc. Those have master tapes and can be remixed as well! Oh goody!

And this is Franks reply when i asked him about remastering and remixing the Columbia albums.You can find it in the Answer forum (Columbia albums)

Sony will never release all that stuff again unless and until I get real popular. How likely is that? With companies like that it's a "big" numbers thing. Plus, they can never re-mix them cuz the 24 track masters are all destroyed. The best you'll ever get is the two-track re-mastered. That's why I had hoped for the original anthology (the three CD set), cuz it had almost 95% of the old stuff. all re-mastered by myself.

Does the master tapes to the Columbia albums exist or not :?: i sure hope that Frank is the liar here.I also hope that Jim West will be able to release them on the just just a minute label one day as well as the unreleased Nanette Workman album with Frank and Jimmy Ayoub.Have you heard any songs from that one by the way?
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Soupy94 » Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:21 pm

An album with Nanette Workman? That would be interesting... for those of you not familiar with her, she was rather popular in Quebec in the 70's, and appears on Sister Change (I believe), off Tales of the Unexpected.
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by EmperorIV » Thu Mar 09, 2006 1:09 pm

Frank used tapes that no one else has access to. BigBeat probably went straight from vinyl.


Willy, there is a note in the liner notes that the Big Beat cd's were remastered from original tapes on loan from someone named Len Jones and that they were "remastered from original analogue tapes"

I was just curious if these were in fact the same tapes...the Repertoire cd releases were from a vinyl source..I know that for a fact because I wasted money on those :x
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by stick » Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:29 am

Can't wait to hear them!....Maxoom will be the first one.
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Bad Rain » Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:40 am

Aren't a 'master tape' and a 'multi track tape' two different things? At least here in Finland we call the final two track mix a 'master tape' and the 'multi track tape' is the one which can be remixed.
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Wild Willy » Sat Mar 11, 2006 3:49 pm

Frank should clear this up when he sees the thread. I am pretty sure that all of the Columbia masters do exist, he just wishes they didn't perhaps, since his "differences" with the major label. I think SDony/Columbia would have to pay Frank to re-mix them and they probably won't. We can wish though.

Frank's remaster of these 3 were from his own copies that no one else has. If I am wrong, Frank will clear it up.

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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Frank Marino » Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:32 pm

Just a quick note to clear up the confusion:

First, there is a difference between what people commonly call a "Master" and a "Multi-track Master".

A Master is the common reference to the final "mixed-down" version of a song, usually on 1/4-inch tape (sometimes 1/2-inch). These Masters were originally recorded as Multi-track, meaning that the individual instruments and overdubs were done on a tape machine which uses very wide tape, up to 2 inches, and the individual tracks on that tape run physically parallel to each other. Usually, this is called the 24-track "Master", but it is not the Master that most people talk about when speaking of "Original Masters". In fact, the real "Original Master" IS the 24-track 2-inch tape. But once this is mixed down to Stereo (2-track 1/4-inch), people in the industry refer to these final 1/4-inch tapes as the Masters. They're more like "Master Mixes".

Obviously you can never "remix" a Master, unless you are referring to the original 2-inch Masters. Once they are mixed to 1/4-inch, all you can ever do with those finals is "re-master" them, meaning that you can re-EQ and/or compress them, perhaps even add some stuff but not take much away or radically alter their components' sounds. You CAN creatively use EQ and such to "bring things out" or "tone things down", but this usually results in changes to surrounding instruments. For instance, if I EQ a song to hear the vocals get a bit brighter, I will invariably affect the guitars or something in the same "tonal spectrum" of the item I modify. So the process of re-mastering is very different than the process of re-mixing, which would require remastering anyway.

Almost 100% of the "re-releases" of any artist are simply "re-masters", made from the original 1/4-inch mixes and simply re-EQ'd. Very rarely will you see a "re-mixed" release, usually because of the costs involved with the whole process.

Now, to my own situation:

My re-releases are "remasters". They were made from the 1/4-inch tapes of original mixes. Nothing is remixed.

The existence of my original tapes is as follows:

My first three albums (Maxoom, Child Of The Novelty and Strange Universe) are owned by a third-party, and I have every reason to believe that the 2-inch Masters still exist (as do the 1/4-inch final mixes), but they are not available to me at all, nor do I expect that they will ever be made available to me. As a matter of fact, I can't even truly be certain that the Multitracks do exist... I just assume they do, but it is entirely possible that they, too, were destroyed... albeit for different reasons than the Columbia Albums (see below). What I do have access to for these albums is the 1/4-inch final mixes, and it is from these that I re-mastered the records.

My next seven albums (the Columbia albums) are still owned by Columbia, but all of the 2-inch Masters have been destroyed. They do not, to my knowledge, exist at all. Therefore I can never re-mix or re-visit these sessions. This was not done, by the way, by the record company. It was done on the initiative of a single person who simply worked for the studio at which the tapes were being stored. This person either destroyed them physically (as was told to me), or sold them to other groups to record over at late-night secret sessions, (as I suspect is the more likely scenario). What I do have access to for these albums is the 1/4-inch mixes, and even some alternate versions of those mixes on 1/4-inch tape. I also, obviously, have access to the vinyl. Any remastering of these 1/4-inch tapes is exactly that... remastering, not remixing... as that is now, and will forever be, impossible.

Everything after that (From Full Circle onward) is available to me in both 1/4-inch mixed form as well as 2-inch Multitrack form, so these could be remixed OR remastered.

So, I hope this clears up some of the confusion. It even confuses me sometimes!

Frank
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Erik » Mon Mar 13, 2006 10:13 am

Thank´s Frank,

For the first time since i started to listen to your music I´m not confused about the "master" situation.To be honest i would prefer re-mastered versions of you albums,not remixed.I´ve heard some remixed albums when new guitar parts and vocals are added because the artist wasn´t pleased with the original sound.I wanna hear your albums the same way i heard them back in the days but with cd sound quality.Not vinyl transfered to cd with parts of songs missing,cracks and pops,etc like the situation is now.Remastered versions of your Columbia albums is just what me and other fans wants.Like i said before,the dream scenario would be if Jim could make a deal with Columbia and release them on his Just in Time label.By the way,cd releases with alternate versions of the songs and/or unreleased stuff from that era wouldn´t be to bad either, :winky

I almost forgot ,i still wanna hear that unreleased Nanette Workman album with you and Jimmy.I know it´s not up to you but it´s sounds like a killer mix to me,Frank,Jimmy and Nanette.

Thank´s for the info

Erik
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by profusion » Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:30 am

I'm sure Frank can explain all of this fully, but I believe he has said before that Columbia *could* properly rerelease all of the IV-->Juggernaut albums if they wanted to, but that they don't think there's enough money in it to bother. But at the same time, they don't want to license the masters for release by some other company, which makes no sense to me But it's not surprising to me because I've heard of quite a few other artists from that era who have the same problem with their former record labels. Their classic albums are effectively "locked up," which seems almost like a malicious act by the record companies. Maybe they don't want the administrative hassle of fishing out the stereo masters, even just to license out to another label?

Given that both "MR Live" and "Tales of the Unexpected" are still in print, I have to think that Columbia sees some kind of money coming in--you'd think a proper remaster of MR Live would be in the cards, since that's the Frank album that gets most of the attention from the general public--not to mention the fact that it's widely acknowledged as an alltime classic live album. Wouldn't it be great if they could rerelease it with a bunch of additional material--wasn't it supposed to be a double-LP originally?

Hey, a guy can dream, can't he? :lol:
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by EmperorIV » Mon Mar 20, 2006 9:23 am

There is an import "remastered" version of MR Live on the Axe Killer label. Unlike the Black Rose releases of Juggernaut, PORR and Whats Next the Axe Killer release seems legit (?)

Maybe Willy and Frank can shed some light on the rerelease of MR Live
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Bob Nelson » Mon Mar 20, 2006 4:49 pm

I have the Axe Killer remaster of "Live". Judging by the liner notes which include quotes by Frank and even a mention of this website (when it was www.wildwilly.com/marino1) I would say it is legit.
And the sound quality is fantastic. This is the version to get of the great "Mahogany Rush Live" album. Unless of course Frank remasters it himself, like he is doing with the other old stuff.
The one that I hope gets the remaster treatment is "Mahogany Rush IV"
I have the Japaneese import version of it, and while it's not bad "IV" could use a remaster job, and I know just the right person to handle it.
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Re: re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe

Post by Soupy94 » Mon Mar 20, 2006 7:10 pm

argus57 wrote: The one that I hope gets the remaster treatment is "Mahogany Rush IV"
I have the Japaneese import version of it, and while it's not bad "IV" could use a remaster job, and I know just the right person to handle it.
I couldn't agree more -- hopefully the suits that control the tape for IV will let Frank get his hands on it.

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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by Soupy94 » Tue Mar 21, 2006 8:02 am

Hello, folks.

I just received a response to an e-mail I sent to Justin Time Records, inquiring about a release date for Frank's first 3-records. Here 'tis:


Hi ,

We don't have a release date yet. We will soon...

Simon



Getting closer! 8)

Ciao,
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Re: re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe

Post by profusion » Wed Mar 22, 2006 12:27 pm

EmperorIV wrote:There is an import "remastered" version of MR Live on the Axe Killer label. Unlike the Black Rose releases of Juggernaut, PORR and Whats Next the Axe Killer release seems legit (?)

Maybe Willy and Frank can shed some light on the rerelease of MR Live
There WAS an Axe Killer reissue of MR Live. It was an extremely limited edition release, and good luck getting your hands on a copy now, especially at a reasonable price. Believe me, I've tried.

I was similarly frustrated by trying to get the recent Rhino limited edition rerelease of the 1978 solo album by the amazing guitarist from Funkadelic, Eddie Hazel, called "Game, Dames & Guitar Thangs." Rhino only produced a few hundred copies of this as part of their 'Handmade' series, and it now sells used for over $200. By the way, if you've never checked out Eddie, you really should if you like the funkier side of Frank Marino. Hazel was featured on many of the earlier Funkadelic albums, and my two favorites with him are "Maggot Brain" and "Standing On The Verge of Getting It On."
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by SelG » Fri Apr 07, 2006 6:59 pm

I have that re-issue of Mahogany Rush Live from Axe Killer. It's no better than the other one, all they did was turn up the volume. There's no huge improvement of sound quality so if you ask me it wasn't worth the 40 or so dollars that I payed to get it on ebay. It is legit, from Sony, they put a little comment in saying how grateful they are to Sony BMG's kindness or something like that.
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re: Maxoom, Child of the Novelty & Strange Universe rema

Post by boltonboy » Sat Apr 15, 2006 2:03 pm

Thanks for the post about the first three albums.

Let's all salivate!!!

MMMMMMmmmmm Yummy!!
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